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It is supposed to be a difficult sleight but I mastered it in about 10 minutes. It was just a fluke and I am not quite sure why I was so lucky. I have been using it all my life but not usually as a card control.

I learned it from an ancient book by a fellow called Charles Roberts. I think the book was called "Tricks with cards" I remember the illustrations being pretty good and that may be why I learned it so quickly.

I have not seen sight nor sound of this book for over 40 years and I am quite sure it is unobtainable. However there is a pretty good description in The Royal Road to Card Magic.

I FINALLY GOT IT!!!!

I now know what my problem is. After an hour or 2 of trial and error with the Classic Pass, i found out my problem. You see, my right hands thumb was gripping BOTH packets, and hardly the bottom packet. Because of the loose bottom packet, the card under the pinky got dragged with the top packet as i transferred the packets. What i did then was i tried the pass this time only having my thumb gripping onto the BOTTOM packet instead of both, and this time i performed the pass FLAWLESSLY and perfectly quietely!!! Wow man, that was hard work!

I thank eveyone who tried to help me out, and by the way, no, the pass is not useless, if its performed right, it is the best way to control a card to the top or do a colour change, nothing can beat it. Ken Krenzel does it so well that he hardly needs any cover for it. If you could do a great pass that was very undetectable, you could even fool magicians. You could go around saying you've invented a new card control, fool everyone when infact your doing passes.. My point is, if its done right, it is 100% foolproof.

well done...its one of those things that you can just practice when watching telly once you get the basics isnt it...if found it teaches you to not stare at your hands when you're doing it...

Mark, I have a copy of that book! think it was published by fulsham or something similar but is definatly out of print now. It belonged to my dad and was the first magic book I read! I still go back to it every now and then. The charlier is taught and decribed as "the one handed pass".
Some other old books I used to love:-

Professional magic made easy - Bruce Elliott

Drawing room magic - Roy Holmes (some great gags and patter, bit dated now but still gives me a chuckle!)

Willane's wizardry "magic stunts, tricks and catches" an old booklet published in 1947 costing 2'6 with a picture of Willane on the cover looking rather dapper in his top hat!

I love all the old books, they're rather facinating. Whats the oldest magic books, or printed material others have????

abraxus wrote:well done...its one of those things that you can just practice when watching telly once you get the basics isnt it...if found it teaches you to not stare at your hands when you're doing it...

now this is a good tip. and ive no idea why i didn't think of it, i do an awful lot of my practise while looking at something else, generally a TV.


kudos on getting it quiet too, my pass makes a LOT of noise, but then most of my magic has been developed for use in loud places so it never worried me, maybe i should work on that though!

I learnt classic pass long time ago, I do card magic on every occcasion, but I use the pass very rarely. Double undercut, riffle shuffle control, or even overhand shuffle control looks natural and does the same job without required misdirection. Anyway there are many videos and books explaining the pass and as for the most moves - most important is to practice, practice, practice ...

to continue: ... what I use sometimes is an Ortiz pass, which is very deceptive and seems perfect to me for a color change or a control. It is even. better as a part of an ambicious card routine, when you put the signed card face up in the deck and than with just a little "shake" it jumps on top.

Way to go! Now that you've leaned the pass, you should start leaning a few effects that use the pass. The great thing about the pass is that it is a great set up for colour changes.

...i'd say maybe next you could look at learning how to glimpse the top card, or palming it (if you don't already - I'm taking it that you already know how to DL)...

gives you alot of leeway for various revelations and so forth...whatever you chose, remember to enjoy it all...

EDIT: meant to say what the above said too, but wont cos its already been said!

I had a similar problem, the selected card moving to the bottom, the problem I seemed to have was I was putting my pinkie too far in betweeen the packets, so it dragged on the top card. Also sometimes when getting a break from a diagonal insertion, I didn't always square the inserted card with the bottom packet properly so my right thumb wasn't gripping it.

And I used to think I was the only person this happenned to, lol. It was never even mentioned in any source I used to learn it.

slightly off topic, but in general when you're learning these kinda things, if it doesnt work for you after practice, try learning something else for a while and just come back to it after a few days/weeks...

give your mind a rest, sometimes just picking up the deck and doing it almost subconciously helps alot...

the telly thing is definately a winner for me, i couldnt charlier to save my life til i got distracted by pretty shiny objects on the tv...

hermann is still my fave...love it infact...there's three others i use too, but im fairly dreadful with names...