talkmagic.co.uk

I'm listening to it on Radio 4...

all a bunch of pantywaists...but i agree - you HAVE to vote...even though i also agree that you'll get sh*fted one way or the other...

but i wont open the can of worms that is the morality of paying taxes...

Agreed that the Vote was a hard won facility which shouldn't be wasted, I just despair that all we're seeing and hearing is spin, ballyhoo and boll, er, airy fairy stuff which won't last more than five minutes after the next Government is formed. If manifestos were legally enforoceable they might be more realistic and if, shudder the thought, they actually listened to Joe Soap in the street and what concerns him, we might also get some policies which are specific to our needs rather than nebulous stuff designed to be spun, turned and disregarded in an instant. OK, I'll put me sopabox away now ....

i'll be honest - though he's a bit nervy, the lib dem guy gets my vote so far...at least their party has stated where they're going to be making cuts...

the other two have just said...erm...well...nuffink...

whoever has tutored them in debate has certainly told them to emphasis "brave" everytime they mention soldiers...

before anyone leaps on me and stabs me up - my grandad fought along side the gherkas and my dad was a good old sailor for twenty years and was even in Vietnam! well..they got shot at just before it all kicked off (so i blame my dad for starting)...

but please...enough of the "brave"...use another word...

pcwells wrote:On the subject of redundancies and unemployment, I vividly remember the mass unemployment that accompanied Thatcherism in the 80s. You'll never be represented by career politicians. Things only change when enough people pay attention, listen to their platitudes, and shout BULLSH!T!!

Hey! That's not fair. You're telling the truth.

as one of thoughs disabled carers who all the parties wan't to give 1 weeks holiday too, unpaid of course, and the bigest synic around, I say.

all I heard was the labour saying quick theres an election on we havant done anything for years but we will make lots of changes and garentees if you re-ellect us, which the conservatives won't.

the conservatives saying the same, wile slagging off the labour.

the liberals saying we've been saying this for years and everytime we tried to make a change you lot blocked it, oh and by the way this is how we're going to pay for it.

so if I was going to vote it would be the liberals...... but I know that none of the parties will give carers minimum wage or give the disabled the winter fuel allowence the pensioners get and you can stick your 1 weeks holiday a year thanxs a bunch.

what gets my goat is that my carers money is taken out of my income support yet I not allowed a crissis grant because I'm working and I can't get tax relife because I'm on a benefit and to get anything I need to fill out tons of forms only for someone in newcastle who dosn't know me to say get lost.

bring back the local jobcenter / benefit agency that new the time wasters and didn't pay them and gave support to thoughs that needed it, now they have to ring for permission to use there own computer system.

Tonight re-enforced the old addage, how do you tell if a politician is lying? You can see their lips moving!

I have to admit that Clegg was the most impressive but he won't get the number of votes. Overall I think that Breown was out of his depth and his constant smirking was annoying before becomming insulting.

They all avoided the real immigration issue which is that the numbers that are cauging the strain on the social and economic are from EU states.

Nothing that any of them say seems to add up and it's going to be the matter of selecting the least worst evil.

dat8962 wrote:Nothing that any of them say seems to add up and it's going to be the matter of selecting the least worst evil.

And you claim the Lib Dems won't get votes. Pah!

I'll be interested to see how things pan out for the Lib Dems this time round.

I think more and more people are disillusioned with both of the big parties and don't particularly want either of them in power. That plus the fact that they've finally been given equal time in these debates might push them well and truly into the ring this time.

The problem for them is that way too many voters are 'dyed in the wool'. They don't know what their party actually stands for, or what it does for them personally. They've just made a particular voting habit part of their identity.

I have no doubt that if some miracle happened and the Lib Dems won the next election, they'd descend the same stinking slope of corrupt mismanagement, spin, soundbites and lazy social policies as New Labour and the Tories before them. But I think they'd be good as the main opposition party - providing their MPs can muster the courage to vote on sensitive issues.

Pete

What I think is interesting about this is that the papers are all saying that Clegg came off the best from this. We may see the Lib Dems do quite well in the election if they can continue to actually get noticed as I think on the whole, most voters tend to forget that they exist and vote either Labour or Conservative depending on who they think will screw things up least.

If it appears that there really is an alternative to the two main parties, maybe more people will vote that way rather than not voting or throwing away their vote but plumping for the lesser of the two evils.

I'd actually like to see more of these live debates. It's good to see some proper arguing even if it is somewhat staged.

I'll probably try to be more sober next time though.

Even the Tory-loving Murdoch press is declaring Clegg the winner of last night's 'debate'.

Interesting. Either they're genuinely commending him on doing a good job, or they're relying on him to take more votes from Labour than from the Tories and have decided to give him a helping hand.

And who said politics isn't riveting?!

Klangster1971 wrote:

Grimshaw wrote:A mess created by one party; New Labour.

I'm not sure that's strictly true, Grimshaw - the collapse of the entire world's banking mecahnism can hardly be laid at Gordon Brown's door.... even if he was the chancellor when something could have been done about it.

You'll forgive me if i was thinking a little more close to home when i referred to a 'mess'. I don't blame Brown for what happened, but i can certainly blame him for his shoddy handling of things afterwards.....ahem....RBS......

The banks clearly had too much power and not enough boundaries. The whole system needs a shaking up. Sadly i don't think any of the parties have the bottle to do so.

To carry on from what i said before, now is a time for change, and i don't mean everything is going to be peachy creamy, i mean look to history for your guide. End of the 70's - country was in a mess because of Labour. Tories took over, things changed. End of the 90's - country was in a mess because of Tories. Labour took over, things changed. Here we stand in 2010, the country is in a mess. You'll forgive me again for being broad and i understand that some people will disagree with that.

Forget colour, it's about reminding those who've ignored us for the last four years that while some things remain in politics, we CAN vote you out of your job. They're coming cap in hand now, and they need reminding that its all too little too late.

This could be good. People may be waking up to the fact that they can actually vote Lib Dem. Now, wouldn't it be interesting if...

Grimshaw wrote:..it's about reminding those who've ignored us for the last four years that while some things remain in politics, we CAN vote you out of your job.

Excellent point. I just don't like the idea that when the opposition take power, they'll claim all those votes as a 'mandate to govern' or a 'clear indication of support' for their rubbish policies.

Pete

themagicwand wrote:This could be good. People may be waking up to the fact that they can actually vote Lib Dem. Now, wouldn't it be interesting if...

I'm beginning to really like Clegg and Cable. They actually seem like relatively normal human beings. If I remember correctly, no Lib Dem was found to be on the take in the expenses scandal. They genuinely don't seem to be evil (i.e: no to a surveillance state, Trident, illegal wars, etc.) just a bit quiet. Maybe now the press have noticed that we have a 3 party state, that'll change.

I SERIOUSLY don't trust Cameron, and there's no way you'd get me to vote Labour after what they've done.