talkmagic.co.uk

Hey this is Joe Fowler, you may know me as JesusJoe.

I am sure some of the more active members have heard this name before, most likely in a not so flattering sense. And yes, I am Him.

I signed up for this account a __long__ time ago and since have been pretty much a very occasional lurker, but am trying to get more active on a wider variety of forums.

Despite what my personal critics say I am not a fan of exposing magic to the general public, instead I am very for magicians sharing ideas, thoughts, and routines. I feel that this generally the common feeling amongst all pro exposure magicians.

I have posted many things about how much better the magic community would be if all magicians, anti exposure and pro exposure, were to come together for the betterment of magic.

I know this may be hit with some hot heads, but please don't PM me with a barrage of hate mail, If you dont want to get along with me than fine, but hate me in private.

Anyway, I assure you that I am not here to try and cause any trouble I am just looking to be a member of a well established community, and for this I have returned to the forum that started it for me. Talk Magic.

Welcome

As far as I can see your site has an area dedicated to exposure.
IF this is the case, as far as I'm concerned your not welcome here.

I resent the term "exposure" being applied to my site.

My site has a strict screening process to guarantee only magicians get in.

After I personally approve each member they are invited to openly talk about tricks and the methods of such tricks without fear of outsiders wandering in.

I have taken the precautions for a reason, like I said I do not condone mass exposure, but within a group of magicians? Of course we can discuss methods.. What is the difference between me teaching a magician a move and my grandpa teaching me a trick when I was 5? Would you berate him for exposure? Doubtful.

If you don't like my site don't join, I assure you you won't be welcome.

Exposure is exposure, it doesn't matter wether you tell one magician or a thousand idiots who logs on to youtube.

The members of this site are all magicians of some sort or other, but, and quite rightly so, exposure is banned.

But as I said this is only my opinion and I apologise if caused offence, but I must say how I feel.

The internet is about freedom of information, but not if someone owns that information. I see sites like yours in a similar vain as peer to peer, and torrent download sites.

You can rent or buy movies quite cheaply, but that doesn't make it right to give them away.

StevieJ wrote:but not if someone owns that information

Sorry buddy, but you can not own information, only how it is presented. The law is quite clear on that. And if you want to hassle me about ethics, it wont work, seeing as I know my stance and I stick with it.

I remind you I never mentioned my site--you brought it up. I post it in my signatures on every forum I am on, I am proud of it.

I will not soliciting for members, or promoting it in any way at all. I could have put the nice big graphic in but knew the reaction that would generate.

I hope we can have better conversations in move on from this beaten horse. No solution has been found yet, do you honestly think we will find one?


Friends?

Fair enough Joe, like I said I really didn't mean to offend. If I got a little carried away I'm sorry.

But your right we perhaps should be using our time here a little more constructively, instead of critisizing opinions. We state our case and leave it at that.

If everyone agreed with each other it would be a boring world.

Friends

You call that screening?!

OK OK

Welcome to the forum.

Like I said, its not what I ask that really matters it is that I ask.

Just by making people register and submit a test I block about 90% of lurkers looking for answers.

Some people register and then don't submit a test, they are held to off topic discussion mostly. Nothing ventured, nothing gained.

I know that some will argue that people could lie, but this isn't a perfect formula, I would never say it is.

And the questions do change on an almost weekly basis, the ones up now are more than over due for an update, they were just put ion to block that 90%, which is much more than some sites do.

Ever try to figure out how many guests come here hoping for exposure? I bet there are hundreds everyday. You block them (and lots of your members too) from any boards that may discuss methods openly, as do I. We are like the same board! (sarcasm)

Thanks for the welcome guys!

Hey Joe, Welcome to the forum.

Welcome to TM.

er.... hi
10 points for anyone who can guess what emoticon I'm going to request


you'd be suprised where the law stands on this kind of thing, you automatically hold the rights the any intellectual property so long as you have some kind of proof you did it first, and it can be enough to stand in a court, so long as you paid enough for your law folk!

Lawrence,

The law, Canadian (where I am) and International clearly states that Ideas/actions cannot be protected, but the description of these ideas/actions can be, and is from the minute they are created.

You can not claim rights on how to throw a football, but that book you wrote on it is all yours.

The same goes for magic.


As long as explanations are made up of 100% original content, this includes videos and text descriptions alike, then these explanations are not only legal, but protected under copyright law.

Intellectual property is broken down into several categories, copyright, which I have just discussed, Trademark, Patents, and Trade Secrets.

Trademark would only apply to names of effect, for example, Ellusionist has trademark on King Rising. This doesn't mean I can't use the name, it simply means I can not sell a similar product using that name. I am allowed to say the name freely, as I am describing an idea with a name that someone else has decided it should be called.

Patents are for inventions. In the magic world this would apply to gimmicks, props, stage illusions etc. The problem with getting something patented is you need to submit explanations of what the item does/how it works. Even if this is done a Patent protects that item from being produced and sold by someone other than the creator. I would still be free to tell anyone how to make it, and make said item for my own use.

Trade Secrets. This one is the closest thing that the magic community can do. I encourage putting this into full action!

A Trade secret is used to protect an idea that a company makes money from. To classify something as a Trade secret you need to a) not sell it to the public or b) If you do sell it, have the buyer agree to a confidentiality clause upon purchase.

Having a little disclaimer when buying from stores is all it would take.

Of course then you would have to prove that the person breaking the agreement actually purchased the effect from you under this agreement. This one wouldn't stop many people who discuss methods. If any of you are on exposure forums at all you may have noticed a lot of the explanations are not the exact method used for the marketed trick, but an educated guess about the method that will yield desired results.


Like Lawrence said, the law is very clear on this. And I have done nothing wrong.

Cheers.

Welcome Jesus

Please, Call me Joe.

JesusJoe was a nickname attained through magic and foot bag!

By setting high scores and getting ridiculous combos, as well as astonishing people with magic a common reaction was "Jesus Joe! how the hell did you do that?"


After a while people referred to me as JesusJoe whenever either of these 2 events took place.. It stuck.