Silver Dream --- Ellusionist.com

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Postby merlino750 » Nov 23rd, '06, 09:07



bishy wrote:
merlino750 wrote:do you think the effect it's worth the time you need to learn?

it seems too much a "for professionals" only performance...


I believe if you like an effect then there is no doubt it is worth putting the time and effort into.

IMHO, We as EN, AH,SH OR WP must be prepared to put days,months or even years into perfecting effects,this is what makes us special :wink:



i agree, if you like an effect, don't think "oh it's a stupid principle" or something else...
And, of corse, you MUST perfect the effect, for best results and to not expose it.

i just mean isn't it too difficult for someone that's new to coin magic?
from what i saw, yes it is...but E doesn't tell you that...eheheh

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Postby Henk » Nov 23rd, '06, 14:51

merlino750 wrote:
bishy wrote:
merlino750 wrote:do you think the effect it's worth the time you need to learn?

it seems too much a "for professionals" only performance...


I believe if you like an effect then there is no doubt it is worth putting the time and effort into.

IMHO, We as EN, AH,SH OR WP must be prepared to put days,months or even years into perfecting effects,this is what makes us special :wink:



i agree, if you like an effect, don't think "oh it's a stupid principle" or something else...
And, of corse, you MUST perfect the effect, for best results and to not expose it.

i just mean isn't it too difficult for someone that's new to coin magic?
from what i saw, yes it is...but E doesn't tell you that...eheheh


If you are a master in a computer game.. and then you buy a new game which is totally different.. you still have to learn it all over again..

the same is with magic I guess.. if a proffesional magician wants to learn silver dream.. he has to go through the same process..

offcourse a proffesional might have an advantage.. because he might allready be familiour with some techniques, and he is used to being patiened to learn a technique..

anyway.. any beginner can learn this trick.. it just takes time..
some need more than others.. but that with everything 8)

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Postby merlino750 » Nov 23rd, '06, 15:14

Henk wrote:
If you are a master in a computer game.. and then you buy a new game which is totally different.. you still have to learn it all over again..



Yes but if you are a master in Role games, and you begin playing online a FPS game, you have to learn it from zero, cause it's totally different...
Of course anyone can do anything, but performing a very very hard trick would not encourage a beginner, that's why they should just be clear about that, to avoid bad surprises to buyers :)

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Postby I.D » Jan 5th, '07, 14:52

RIGHT ..... MY REVIEW ON SILVER DREAM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


The effect and what they say has been posted in this thread earlier.. Ill just add my opinions..


Non Gimmicked Version..

After working through Bobo's book and just beginning to pick up the concepts on palming, transfers, steals etc... I was about to give up on sleeving having succeeded with a success rate of 0%... yes 0% !!! I personally would have trouble sleeving my wrist!!

After putting the DVD in LAST NIGHT at about 12.30am and watching through Justins explanation, I actually felt a glimmer og hope before I even tried it..

Justin explains the ''problem'' with the traditional sleeving methods, which do work of course.. but reasons which probably put most magicians off sleeving. Justin refines sleeving and shows a slightly alternate handling which makes sleeving A LOT easier and practical..

After around 30 minutes practice I actually hit a success rate of 60%.. a FANTASTIC result after such short time practicing..

He also modifies a couple of other standard handlings to make this way of sleeving practical..

The DVD itself breaks down each vanish into sections and they are gone through with a finecomb, very professionally done... this DVD is so far from the ellusionist branded garb we sometimes see churned out. Justin has been working on this for 12 years I think and it is clear that he wants this done right. He explains that it IS HARD and it is supposed to be. I agree. It will take me AGES before I am ready to perform this. I came on leaps and bounds yesterday but there is so much more to sleeving than well.. sleeving!!

Best thing.. you end totally clean!!! or so it seems, very easy to clean up real

Gimmicked Version

This is for the you-tube generation that do not want to practice sleights and ellusionist have catered for that.

Justin Miller does not seem happy teaching this part of the DVD it is kind of thrown in at the end over 6 minutes..

It does look impressive on the demo.. but Justin has added things to it.. the version that is taught is ok but you end VERY DIRTY.. there is a way to clean up but again.. not anywhere near as impressive..

To be fair, wearig aT-shirt, the first vanish is superb.. you cant get much cleaner than this.. but it falls apart on the second and third.. and again.. Im proabably saying this because Im copmparing it to the no gimmicked version. It can work beautifully, Justins performance echoes that stamtement. But I dont like handling gimmicky things unless they can be cleaned up instantaneously.

Overall

Once I have mastered this given a few months practice, this will be a staple part of my performance. My first coin routine proper.. ( non tabled ) and I have given myself the best chance of mastering the hardest coin sleight ever IMHO.

Non Gimmicked : 10 / 10

Gimmicked : 8 / 10 .. I know I slated it but that was out of Bias.. credit where credits due I gues..

www.youtube.com/brum2redmagic !! Youtube Project started.. early days

Reading: Nothing right now
Studying: loving band redemption
Performing: Speechless, Stand up Monte, Coinvexed,
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Postby Atomo » Jan 18th, '07, 15:21

Hey I.D, just wanted to see how you were getting on practicing this routine. I think i started about the same time as you, and my progress has been slow but steady. I think the second vanish is the hardest, talk about alot of things happening at once!

just wondered how you are finding sleaving in genreal, and what type of clothes you've been able to accomplish the vanishes in, i've been doing it in a sweater that has a small breast pocket, i deliberatly practiced in something that had tight sleaves which would leave no room for error. my thinking being that if i can do it in that top, it will be a peice of cake wearing my jacket, and it seems to working a treat.

safe

Atomo

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Postby I.D » Jan 19th, '07, 17:30

All my tops had Tight sleeves... very tight.. I went out and bought some January sale bargains!! Only need a slightly loose sleeves

Any sleeves do as long as they have a little give in them. In general I find this routine excellent. On the first vanish my hit rate is 9/10 usually 10/10 now...just sit at work vanishing anything I can lay my hands on..

The second vanish is complex, however I have all the seperate parts down, including the vanish. I actually use this method on occasions now for a single coin vanish.. it works well as they hear the coin go and because I wear a wedding ring and a silver bracelet, they can still 'hear it' in my hands after it vanishes, which makes them think they still see it there a few seconds after it goes. nice impact that is!!

The third vanish, I dont have a ** so I am practicng my ** with all concentrate.. its a bloody hard move.. I am trying to think of another way to accomplish it. I tend to be able to vanish the 3rd coin in the same way I do the first.. the coins do not tend to talk.


I do not like the gimmicked version at all really. It can work nice enough but I no like having dirty hands

www.youtube.com/brum2redmagic !! Youtube Project started.. early days

Reading: Nothing right now
Studying: loving band redemption
Performing: Speechless, Stand up Monte, Coinvexed,
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Postby Atomo » Jan 19th, '07, 17:53

hey man,

I totally agree with you about that third vanish, sometimes i can do it perfectly, but id say im still only about 4/10 at the minute. I wanted to perform this the other day, but didnt want to use the third vanish, so i mixed it up and put in Sankeys Messiah vanish instead, I do a slight variation it which leaves your hands totally clean, and then you can still go on to 'snap' the coin. it worked out really nicely and got a good baffled reaction from mrs Atomo. PM me if you want to know about that third vanish man, its a real fooler. I can totally relate to what you said about vanishing practice, i often sit watching tv flicking the entire contents of my wallet up my sleeve.

never got round to trying the gimmicked version. But i would reccomend CoinOne as an excellent gimmicked routine, infact, once i have it perfected i will start with coin one, and then follow it with silver dream, together i think they make a really visual routine that is about as close to real magick as you can get with coins. Check out my review of CoinOne in the 'Electronic Media' section. I think you'd really like it dude.

peace out

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Postby I.D » Jan 19th, '07, 18:22

I dont have trouble with the third vanish the conventional way, but I dont have the female anatomy ( ill pm you to let you know what I mean, due to exposure I am using really bad 'alternative words lol ). But the seconf method he suggests uses a move I simply find too hard to accomplish and my patience wears thin with it.

I know the messiah vanish off Jays Revolutionary DVD, I never thought about that.. I might use it soon but at the moment I dont have the 'eyes' for it !! *think*

I have not performed silver dream, I promised I would not perform it before April to give myself ample opportunity to perform it perfectly

www.youtube.com/brum2redmagic !! Youtube Project started.. early days

Reading: Nothing right now
Studying: loving band redemption
Performing: Speechless, Stand up Monte, Coinvexed,
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Postby AcrylicAce » Feb 3rd, '07, 20:40

I just wanted to add one thing.

No one should be afraid to learn this trick. It will not takes TONS of time. I have just started with magic and I can already sleave the coin about 6/10 times. Any magician that is more experience than me (dont know anything) will learn this fairly fast with how good this dvd is.

He goes through all the steps and keeps it SO clear. I have just been working on it for like 2 days and I can already do the first 2 steps fairly well... and this is the first trick I have ever learned.

It will take some time to perfect it but I just wanted to say to anyone that likes this trick that it is not THAT difficult and you should not be intimidated.

--AcrylicAce

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Postby bronz » Feb 4th, '07, 11:13

That's entirely true AcrylicAce, when you put the time in it's very rare that you can't nail the mechanics of a move even as a complete beginner. Some take longer than others (it took me literally three months of constant practice to nail the muscle pass) but generally even the trickier sleights aren't super difficult to pick up.

Of course there's a very wide gulf between learning how to do a move and performing it properly, but that's another thing. The point is you shouldn't be put off a routine because other people tell you it's hard to do and you think it'll be out of your league.

The artist who does not rise, descends.
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Postby thwangs » Feb 7th, '07, 02:42

This is just what I think of it...

10/10. for sure. If done right, it's AMAZING. they won't believe it!

I'm talking about the non-gimmicked, of course...

yeah, it's kinda hard to learn. but if you REALLY want to learn it, and are willing to put the time into it, you won't regret it. and the best part is that all you need are a few coins and ABSOLUTELY impromptu. can bring it out whenever, just work on your small talk.

yeaaaah. go buy it.

by the way, can someone give me tips on the second vanish? i can't do it without looking suspicious -.-

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Postby I.D » Feb 7th, '07, 18:15

thwangs wrote:can someone give me tips on the second vanish? i can't do it without looking suspicious -.-


Yeh.. practice.. Justin explains that you HAVE to learn in steps.. you will never perfect it practicing it at performance speed.

If you are performing this within 2 months of purchase.. IMHO.. you are not performing it correctly.. sleeving is the hardest method Ive have ever encountered with coins.. next to classic palm.. and there is just no way you can perfect this routine so quickly.

Justin took 12 years to get to the stage he is at now with this.. respect the art and even if you think you have it down.. dont perform it until you can fool yourself in a mirror..

I can do the routine now easily.. all the way through.. but im not performing this until April.. simply out respect for its beauty.. i do this routine daily in a mirror ( I have one now :D ) and I will continue to until I can do the whole thing without looking at my hands once.. this way I know I have the moves down perfect..

then when I can do that.. work on performing it looking where I need to for misdirection and knowing ful well I can hit it 10/10 without effort..

Then I will perform

www.youtube.com/brum2redmagic !! Youtube Project started.. early days

Reading: Nothing right now
Studying: loving band redemption
Performing: Speechless, Stand up Monte, Coinvexed,
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Postby Manolius » Feb 25th, '07, 09:19

i think what happens is that people may feel intimidated because this trick is hard or just not as simple as infusion or revolution. (both from ellusionist by the way). For me, this is what magick is and should be, the others are just tricks. Magic is suppoused to take skill, and like anything good in life, you HAVE to be good at it or it woould be just to simple.

i really like this trick. this is by no means for pro's only. Its a magic trick, a real one and it's really good.

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Postby I.D » Feb 26th, '07, 14:09

Do you work for Ellusionist?? :lol:

www.youtube.com/brum2redmagic !! Youtube Project started.. early days

Reading: Nothing right now
Studying: loving band redemption
Performing: Speechless, Stand up Monte, Coinvexed,
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Postby Manolius » Mar 2nd, '07, 02:30

I.D wrote:Do you work for Ellusionist?? :lol:


haha not really... is just that i been recently buying some tricks for that site and this one (SD) has been the best so far.

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