Elmsey Count

Struggling with an effect? Any tips (without giving too much away!) you'd like to share?

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Elmsey Count

Postby blindchild » Dec 31st, '03, 18:35



hey folks,
i was just wondering how someone new to magic learns how to do magic.
i bought one or two books that show how to do easy tricks, but most of them assume you know what certain techniques are. such as the "Elmsey Count". where can i find out how to do some of these techniques. Are you guys allowed to tell me how to do an Elmsey Count?
its not really a trick, its more a manuever which you need to know to be able to perform tricks. i think it would be a great help to beginners if these fundamentals were explained, as you're not going to impress anyone by "palming" a card or performing a "pinky break". its how you use these techniques and manuevers, thats where the magic comes in.
so please i beg you. explain to me please what the Elmsey Count is and how to do it.
it would really help me alot.
thank you :)

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Postby Jing » Dec 31st, '03, 18:48

If the books you've brought presume you know the moves then, maybe you should save them until you're a bit better.
Any magician on here will tell you to buy...
For Cards, the Royal Road to Card Magic By Jean Hugard and Frederick Braue - It shows the moves and then some routines for them.
For Coins, Modern Coin Magic By J.B. Bobo.

There are also a whole host of videos and dvds for the beginner to buy and learn from. Have a look on the reviews section.

Edward,

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Postby Mandrake » Jan 1st, '04, 05:07

I can suggest videos/DVDs such as Basic Card Technique by Richard Kauffman and, if you do a search on this name you'll see all the other references which might help.

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Postby magicdiscoman » Jan 1st, '04, 05:12

http://cnb-host2.clickandbuild.com/cnb/ ... _info-null

just ordered this cd covers both books mentioned and a mentalist book too expext a review soon.

should compliment what you already have :lol:

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Postby nickj » Jan 1st, '04, 15:10

You could also try buying certain packet tricks like twisted sisters which use the elmsley count and have a description of how to do it in the instructions.

You understand that we can't discuss the mechanics of trick in parts of the forum that are open to the public, but if you keep visiting the board and making contributions you will eventually be granted acccess to the magicians only sections where we can give you more detailed help.

I hope you find what you are looking for.

Nick

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Postby flourishman » Jan 6th, '04, 17:27

the elmsley count is a way of apparently showing four face down cards whilst really hiding a face up one. by the way have any of you guys got pat fallons irish three card trick.what do you think of it?

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Postby Luker21 » Jan 19th, '04, 22:29

i just mastered the elmsley count, its a tricky buggar! practise loads and it definately comes i didnt think it would. i learnt how to do it from the twisted sisters book but its also in other books, the definitions all seem to be the same though, i find getting it right comes quicker if you watch yourself in the mirror, if you watch yourself doing it backwards for a while then change to normal it seems much easier. dont know if that really makes sense but there you go. hope you get it, be patient and dont get frustrated. :x

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Postby taneous » Jan 20th, '04, 07:53

Hope this doesn't count as exposure - but this is quite a good website which explains every card sleight I can think of - including the Elmsley count
Edit: URL moved to MO area
It obviously isn't a substitute for any of the books mentioned, but it's a nice reference to have.
I'm pretty new to this site - so if I'm breaking the rules I apologize..

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Postby nickj » Jan 20th, '04, 13:02

Well, I can't get it to load so I can't tell if it should be here or not!

If any of us mods do decide that it counts as exposure I guess the link will be moved to the MO section.

Edit:ok I've got it now and I'm afraid I will have to move it.

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Postby Part-Timer » Jan 20th, '04, 14:36

I learned the Elmsley Count from "Alex Elmsley's Four Card Trick" a packet trick I bought when I was about 11. It is, incidentally, one of the best packet tricks I know (not that I know many).

The Royal Road to Card Magic won't help you, I'm afraid, as the Elmsley Count is rather too recent (one of the disadvantages of RRtCM).

I think it's in the Card College series somewhere. There is also a DVD of Elmsley stuff that includes the Count and the trick I mentioned, or you can buy the Four Card Trick in a couple of places:

Search against elmsley and "four card trick" and you'll find some places you can get the DVD and the trick itself.

I have to say that effects that expect you to know sleights already really annoy me. Even if it says something like "you must know X to use this effect" on the packaging (unlikely), a lot of the time you are buying by phone or over the internet, so how will you find out until it's too late?

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Postby BaBaBoom » Jan 20th, '04, 14:44

It can also be found on page 28 of Scott Guinns You'll be pleasantly surprised!

http://www.greatscott-itsmagic.com/product.php?id=019

Another great book by the man himself :)

...
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Postby nickj » Jan 20th, '04, 14:46

'Tis a much debated problem. I have manged to avoid it by learning as many moves as possible so that it's only particularly obscure ones that would catch me out, and they tend to be written up in the trick anyway.

Now, where's that thread about learning sleights versus self working stuff for beginners, I think I have another argument in my favour....

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Postby Part-Timer » Jan 20th, '04, 15:02

Well, it's more whether the product even gives you the chance to learn the sleight (fine, in my book) or if it expects you to have access to/already know another move or product, in which case, not so fine (unless very generic, like "You'll need a deck of Bicycle cards" or "Do a false shuffle").

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Postby Luker21 » Mar 3rd, '04, 22:33

hi there.
can anyone tell me where to find or send me details of how to do the elmsley count in the hand. what i mean is that i have seen a lot of people keep the pack in their palm instead of holding it with outstretched fingers as i do. i have a feeling the palm one will be easier, or am i wrong, it is just that i find it hard to line up the cards edges for the secret move.
i would greatly appreciate any help. thanks.

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Postby nickj » Mar 3rd, '04, 22:43

Most people generally find it easier to do the actual move at the fingertips but the cards do line up better and the count looks more natural in the hands. E-mail Mog, he has a couple of videos of deep hand elmsley counts he might send to you, I think he has two, one of him performing one and a short tutorial I filmed when I developed one for myself and people were interested.

If you feel up to it though you could try to devise one yourself, if you know how to do it at the fingers and are getting that almost right it isn't too much work to modify it, I managed it over a period of a couple of days to get the whole thing right and a few simple mods done.

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