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I've just started working on the classic pass, with little success I might add (hey! it’s only day two… I’ll get it ), but it seems to me that the turnover pass, although I’m not completely sure how it’s done, would offer more cover. Can anyone comment on this?

learn to do it with only one finger as support. (the pinky) this way the front doesnt have a massive obvious cut in it.

Hello Bird.

There's loads of advice on here about the pass, have a look in the "support & tips" section using the search function. Spend a good afternoon browsing!

In the meantime, here's my tuppence..

I found the Hermann (turnover) pass a bit easier to learn and yes, it affords a little more cover then the classic pass but there's a price to pay. Turning over the deck needs an excuse and adds unnecessary movement.

The classic pass doesn't do this, obviously. It's a good idea to stick with it though, as I reckon it's a staple move (though not everyone agrees ).

My advice would be to keep practising both of them! (:roll: ) but keep things nice and slow for now. Don't work on your speed until everything is nice and smooth.
Then, and only then, try and speed things up. Use a mirror to see where you are flashing or where you need to cover. It doesn't need to be perfect at first, you'll be able to get away with a reasonable pass under misdirection.

Good luck.

The pass is a very deceptive move when done correctly, there is a lot of variations on the pass also.

I am curently working on a single effect for the turnover pass, where i show the botom isnt their card then turn the top card (DL) to show it isnt their card then proceed to an erdnase card change so the top card change to their card.

This is very easy and probably have been used a lot in the past but it put the turnover pass to good use i think.

Ive also been using the cover pass for years in my ACR because it set me up with a D/L and without any suspicious move i can make the card travel from middle twice in matter of seconds in the simplest looking manner i know of, just casting a shadow over the card really does all the magic!

And i used/trained the riffle pass since ive started in magic, ive come up with a very deceptive pattern to use it without actually riffling the cards letting the specs believe i havent closed the deck yet after the pass is done. Saying something in the line of "Any magician could tell you what rank the card is." Droping the pack on top and opening the fingers wide so the deck stand flat in your hand visible from every angles. From their anything is possible...

I hope im giving you good ideas to train your pass with, the classic pass and riffle pass are definatly the 2 pass you should master before looking further, practice the missdirection needed and dont forget that a larger action will cover a smaller one.

Then if you think you like and will use the pass in your acts then you should get some more dvds/books about its variations. I still have an old VHS tape of richard Kauffman (On the pass), i believe is the name, thats where i found the cover pass and his method is really diferent from every other i seen.

Altho other peoples are right, you dont need the pass that much these days, you can easily get away with many other methods but a good pass still one of the most deceptive control ever thought off.

The "spread pass" is very easy to do. You should have no trouble with it.
And because it is executed in the action of closing a spread, it is invisible.

I recommend sliding the top half down and not tilting it too much. More deceptive that way.
I find the pass very useful for certain effects and although it's not totally invisible (my spread pass is near enough though) I use misdirection a lot as has been previously suggested.
Don't hurry to make the pass. There are good moments where the specs attention is completely off your hands.

Roy Walton's effect 'Pass At Red' is a great one to get yourself familiar with performing the pass during an effect as it includes a wonderful moment of misdirection. I use the pass in about three of my effects and it's never been detected.

It actually took me 6 minutes to learn the pass, and that was from Royal Road

You beat me by 4 minutes. It took me 10 minutes. I learned it from some ancient book. I think it was called "Tricks with Cards" by Charles Roberts but I may be wrong.

I was amazed at how quickly I learned it. I thought it was supposed to take me months and months. Or at least that is what all the books said.

Mind you it took me two years to learn the bloody DL. It drove me insane trying to get the hang of it.

mark lewis wrote:You beat me by 4 minutes. It took me 10 minutes. I learned it from some ancient book. I think it was called "Tricks with Cards" by Charles Roberts but I may be wrong.

I was amazed at how quickly I learned it. I thought it was supposed to take me months and months. Or at least that is what all the books said.

Mind you it took me two years to learn the bloody D/L. It drove me insane trying to get the hang of it.

It was the other way around for me. It took me about a month and a half to get a good pass, but about 5 minutes to nail the D/L.

Most people find the DL easier than the pass. I am a special and unique individual.

mark lewis wrote:I am a special and unique individual.

Believe me. I know.

mccabe24 wrote:

mark lewis wrote:I am a special and unique individual.

Believe me. I know.

Haha...

I can highly recommend Kauffmans "On the pass", too. Very comprehensive

~Sym~

Kaufmann is also a special and unique individual. Just mention my name to him and you will see what I mean. Or if you really want to have some fun simply say the magic words "Jeff Busby" and you will see immediately how special and unique he is.

The pass can be a useful tool, but it's not for every occasion. I like the comment about the side steal. Olivier Macia has a really good version of this (I like it anyway) in his video Control Freak. in addition, he has two other options that accomplish the same ends and may be easier for some people to do. The real issue is really what you are more comfortable with and whether such a move is essential either to your performance or your style.

I also agree with the lady that misdirection is a good portion of what makes the pass work so well. Speed is great when you can get it, but in the meantime, work on form and smoothness. It's kinda like lifting weights. The better the form, the more quickly you'll move up in the long-run. Remember that practice doesn't make perfect: PERFECT practice makes perfect.

Ho ho ho, whoever it was that put together that wonderful Vernon tribute clip that was in filesharing recently certainly knows how special and unique Kaufmann is. They included his lovely quote to Vernon's son: "Your father was an alcoholic and you are too".