talkmagic.co.uk

I've been in the forums for quite some time now and I had my own share of sentiments against a company called E. However, if ever there was something they are good at...it's how they market and hype up their products.

Although their market is focused more on the beginners (or kiddies...in my book), I think their new product, Ultragaff is interesting. I've been always very visual in my style of card magic, people really dig those type. Aside from the usual moving pips, flash paper cards to Masuda's WOW, I have my share of gaff cards. It's been a long time since I got something from E (Box Monster?). Aside from the usual "hype up", I'm actually pretty excited!

I'm just trying to know what are your thoughts on this?



BTW...the DVD training is darn expensive. I just ordered the gaff only.

hey,

I've been looking at this deck for a while, it seems like it could be really nice to use (good quality stock etc) and some of the effects in the promo vids look like they are some really original cards.

However, loooking at them, it seems like it might be cheaper (and more norma; ish - ie less obvious gaff cards) just buying a red / blue gaff deck

If you get them let me know what they are like - post a review etc?

Dan

I don't know, Ultragaff? It sounds to much like a gimmick for a gaff. Is it just a gaff deck or is there more to it?

It's just a bunch of gaff cards. The word "ultra" is just a reference to the amount of hype "E" like to put on stuff. There are some really weird ones in there. Personally I am not sure how much mileage can be gotten from a sword stabbing a king on a card, or seemingly peeling back the card to reveal the batteries for the deck.

Arkesus wrote:I am not sure how much mileage can be gotten from a sword stabbing a king on a card

You know one of those comes free with every normal deck, right? The King of Hearts.

Personally, I am finding all these super dooper ultra extra special taste the difference (?!) gaffed cards to be rather tiresome now. Don't get me wrong, I have purchased the Ghost gaff deck (and normal Ghost deck) in addition to a Shadow Masters deck, but have not used them in a performance yet. To be honest, I purchased them more because I like the look of them rather than to perform with them.

Apart from certain effects that rely on the revelation of gaffed cards, e.g. Blizzard (to name just one), I am of the belief that standard gaffed cards should not be seen by the audience. Generally, I don't want my spectators to get used to seeing gaffed cards; I just don't think this can be a good thing in the long term.

I'm with replicant on this one, these just seem to say 'here, everyone. I'm using trick cards'

Putting aside the hype and the kiddie factor of the E gaffs, the thing that really annoys me is how you can't buy each gaff seperately. If you like the idea of a 7 of diamonds and an 8 of clubs (or whatever it is) printed ontop of each other on the same card, then to perform that trick you have to buy the entire deck, even if you're not going to get any use whatsoever out of the other 53.

And the "training" DVD is another money-spinner. If you can't look at a gaff card and work out for yourself how it might be used in an effect, then what sort of card magician are you? A 12 year old one, is probably the answer.

Things like this bug me even more because I've fallen for this in the past - I have the Ellusionist blue-backed gaff deck and the Army of 52 DVD. What I bet a lot of people don't realise about the DVD before they order it, is it actually doesn't cover very much ground at all. It gives you tutorials for like 4 different gaff effects and that's it. There are 54 (I think!) gaff cards in the deck and the majority are not covered!

Granted, some of the effects possible with some of these new gaffs, if done well, would be totally great and pretty funny - but I get the feeling that all things considered its more of a marketing scam and the vast majority of Ultragaff decks sold are going to find homes with rubbish magicians and children who can ill afford them.

The only time I've ever seen gaff effects done well is by people like Houchin and Garcia, who, let's face it, are only performing the effect to promote and sell the deck.

I believe www.cards4magic.co.uk sells individual gaff cards, such as a 3C and 6S on one card, these are priced at £1 per card, but if you only want a few, then it'l work out cheaper and more economical on your carbon footprint, not having as much wasted paper!

yes but they aren't going to be selling the single cards from this deck.

Lady of Mystery wrote:I'm with replicant on this one, these just seem to say 'here, everyone. I'm using trick cards'

Doesnt the same apply when using DF cards, which I use quite often, and can even hand out in the classic Aniversary Waltz...I simply think these cards arent suited to the British Marketplace, where people are always on the lookout to catch people out, as opposed to the American market, where people have the ethic of being entertained-so the more props the better? (not looking for an argument-just healthy debate!! )

thebigcheese, a DF card is what I would class as a "standard" gaffed card and it is intrinsic to the effect in a trick such as Anniversary Waltz. The revelation of a gaffed card in this instance is justified and, indeed, part of the punchline, if you will. My point is the DF card does not draw unnecessary attention to the deck under those circumstances; it's revelation brings the trick to a natural conclusion without undue suspicion. Some of the Ellusionist gaffed cards, however, are so obvious they virtually scream "trick card!" and coupled with the fact that the performer is likely to be using an unusual deck at the time, e.g. Ghost deck, I think this would elicit a different response from the spectator than Anniversary Waltz (or Blizzard) would. In any case, with very few exceptions, I don't perform card tricks which reveal gaffed cards to the spectators for reasons which I stated in my previous post. That's not to say I don't use gaffed cards in some of my effects - just that the audience are not aware that those same cards are present.

Oh dear, I do hope that made some sort of sense. I know what I mean in my head but sometimes my written skills fail me.

queen of clubs wrote:And the "training" DVD is another money-spinner. If you can't look at a gaff card and work out for yourself how it might be used in an effect, then what sort of card magician are you? A 12 year old one, is probably the answer.

I agree with you on that one. Whether or not gaff magic is "as effective" as non-gaff, aside from particular effects, is perhaps a matter of personal taste or preference. But I can't really see the need for a "training DVD" regarding gaffed cards. They're not teaching any new moves here, just the same moves you'd generally see, but with gaffed cards.

I'm not ashamed to say this, but when I first started magic, not too long ago, I was overcome with CUPS and bought the Army of 52 Blue gaff deck. The videos and reactions + hype was too much and I couldn't help myself. While pretty and nicely printed, I practiced and developed small routines for each one. The only problem being I never used them. Too much difficulty in adding the cards and removing them when combined with other normal tricks. At the end of the day the reactions were similar to normal tricks, but with more emphasis on the cards being "cool"/"magical" than myself as a performer.

Thus I have learnt my lesson. No more unneccesary gaff cards again. Until I can get milage from the ones I have.

Replicant wrote:thebigcheese, a DF card is what I would class as a "standard" gaffed card and it is intrinsic to the effect in a trick such as Anniversary Waltz. The revelation of a gaffed card in this instance is justified and, indeed, part of the punchline, if you will. My point is the DF card does not draw unnecessary attention to the deck under those circumstances; it's revelation brings the trick to a natural conclusion without undue suspicion. Some of the Ellusionist gaffed cards, however, are so obvious they virtually scream "trick card!" and coupled with the fact that the performer is likely to be using an unusual deck at the time, e.g. Ghost deck, I think this would elicit a different response from the spectator than Anniversary Waltz (or Blizzard) would. In any case, with very few exceptions, I don't perform card tricks which reveal gaffed cards to the spectators for reasons which I stated in my previous post. That's not to say I don't use gaffed cards in some of my effects - just that the audience are not aware that those same cards are present.

Oh dear, I do hope that made some sort of sense. I know what I mean in my head but sometimes my written skills fail me.

I understand where your coming from, in that the DF is a subtle gaff card, and because it gets used in many classic effects such as aniversary waltz, then it slips by..Also because DF's are a very old gaff card, they are seen as a classic of magic. Although I wouldnt own an Elusionist gaff deck, I believe, that if used subtely, then even the most absurd gaff card could be played off to good effect (possibly not this battery thing ) if used in a normal routine, but just with a kicker ending. After all, ive been accused of using trick cards by making a card transpose in spectators hands or appear in my wallet or bottle, (even with a borrowed deck!). So as far as the spectator is concerned, if you could make a WHOLE card disspear, then why not just the pip on an ace of spades. Ultimatly, its laymen you want to impress, not other magicians...