talkmagic.co.uk

by **bananafish** » Apr 6th, '05, 13:30

I worry that we who use this forum are turning into a group of people eager to get as much as we can with out giving anything back in return. Scroungers who want to take the money and run. Rather than a community of like minded people coming together to discuss our art and further it through dedication, patience and persitent practise. I know which of those two groups I would like to be a member of and it grieves me to see so many eager new magicians going down the path of least resistance and following the crowd into a frame of mind which goes against everything that the Magic Fraternity have spent centuries upholding. There are no quick solutions to becoming a good magician, it doesn't work like that. It takes hard work and practise, something that seems to be worryingly lacking in many magicians at the moment, particularly young ones. This is not an ageist statement, simply a sign of the times.

Wow - I actually found that a liitle harsh, if not downright insulting. You complain about people wanting something for free without giving anything back, and yet that is exactly what you were offering - what the heck did you expect?

From the quality of your posts you have a reputation of a skilled cardician, so naturally if you offered a free effect - readers would assume it probably won't just be dross. If one of the newer members posted the same message then I would suspect the thread wouldn't have had as many replies.

You seem to be implying that everyone who responded should feel ashamed for asking for something for nothing. What a bizarre outlook. Maybe if you had said at the start you have been "working on a new effect and it is now finished", it would have been a bit cheeky of people to ask to see it, offering nothing in return - but shessh man, you offered it out for free!!! I really fail to see any valid point being made here.

Of course we want to see a new Goldfish effect. We have seen your video clips, Some of us have seen some of your own effects in the MO area - who wouldn't want to see a new effect?

Thats like saying you have £10 notes to give away and then complaining that we are all selfish when we ask for them. What an odd outlook.

As a community - most people that have access to the MO areas have at one time or other offered routines up for discussion. Some of them are extremely workable and really should be in books, so yes it was a little starnge you offering it to anyone that asked - but that was your free choice to do so.

What an utterly bizarre thing to say. It reminds me of the child in the school ground with a bag of sweets.

those that ask don't get, thos that don't ask, don'y want.

by **GoldFish** » Apr 6th, '05, 13:40

Sorry, I didn't mean it to be an insult. It wasn't my intention to make people feel guilty either. In retrospect you're right, it was a little harsh, but at the time I thought it would be more interesting to see how many responses such a thread would recieve.

I'm sorry if I offended anybody, but it has been something that has been worrying me for a while.

I'll be posting the PDF of my "effect" in the MO area for those who have access. For those who don't but have a genuine interest in Cards, and in particular the Ambitious Card Routine, just give me a shout via PM and I'll send it over. Just for the record, before I start more cause for offense, it's more of a concept than an effect. It's something that I have never come accross before but it's so mischevious that I'd be suprised if it's original.

by **daleshrimpton** » Apr 6th, '05, 14:13

For the record, it didn’t enter my head to ask what kind of effect it was, since, as most people know, I have an interest in just about every conceivable kind of magic there is.

by **AndyRegs** » Apr 6th, '05, 14:28

Isn't it in the DNA of a magician to want to know how other magicians work. Anyone who has read anything about the history of magic will know what lengths some of the greatest magicians ever (thurston, Keller, houdini etc) went to discover each others secrets. I'm sure they wouldn't have said no if offered the information on a plate.

by **JuanTheMan** » Apr 6th, '05, 15:14

I assumed that the original post was asking for folks to look at the effect and offer a critique - hence my response.

Those who visit this, and simliar fora, regularly know very well that exposure won't occur so I, for one, don't even consider it now. If I want to know how something works, I'll hit the books or DVDs. I admit that I was stumped a few days ago about something which I posted and it got the experts sctratching their heads too.

by **magicdiscoman** » Apr 6th, '05, 15:56

mr fish i agree with your comments and that of the other posters and can see both sides and as i don't realy have any proper comment either way i'll just say.

:lol:

hello consultant here :lol:

i did not ask why just offered :oops:

by **katrielalex** » Apr 6th, '05, 16:28

AndyRegs wrote:Isn't it in the DNA of a magician to want to know how other magicians work. Anyone who has read anything about the history of magic will know what lengths some of the greatest magicians ever (thurston, Keller, houdini etc) went to discover each others secrets. I'm sure they wouldn't have said no if offered the information on a plate.

I sort of agree with Andy here. I think that if you offer anything for free, people (me included

) will ask for it.

Now you point it out, what type of effect is it? I'm really only a cardician

. Kati

by **GoldFish** » Apr 6th, '05, 16:49

GoldFish wrote:I'll be posting the PDF of my "effect" in the MO area for those who have access. For those who don't but have a genuine interest in Cards, and in particular the Ambitious Card Routine, just give me a shout via PM and I'll send it over. Just for the record, before I start more cause for offense, it's more of a concept than an effect. It's something that I have never come accross before but it's so mischevious that I'd be suprised if it's original.

by **magicdiscoman** » Apr 6th, '05, 16:51

will has proposed doing an ac routine useing a one ahead principle, as a none cardy myself i can still see the benefits of this idea and anyone who does the ac will find this of great benefit.
its posted in the mag only section for thoughs who have access.

by **seige** » Apr 6th, '05, 17:19

Hmmm... mixed feelings about this really...

1. What a weird way to gain insight into the way our minds work

2. Is it right for us to be trying to 'analyse' each other like this?

3. Is this considered an experiment, or is this merely a 'Look what a clever sod I have been'

Will, sorry mate, but I really think that your analytical comments are a tad out of order. Bananafish's comments are something I'd stand by...

Your little test did nothing but entice—and the fact that people acted upon it was in their own good faith of helping you out—not wanting a free effect I would imagine.

What you did was deceive people... not 'provoke' them. There are plenty of 'givers' here... and the comments/feedback were genuine offers—people were willing to GIVE you the time of day, not TAKE a freebie.

The forum is almost like a microclimate... it needs a balance to run smoothly. Yes, there are givers, and takers, and neutrals. That's just the way it is I'm afraid.

And the fact that the post contained no reference to the effect, in my mind, was an added mystery.

I think the term for what you've accomplished here is entrapment.

by **GoldFish** » Apr 6th, '05, 18:35

seige wrote:3. Is this considered an experiment, or is this merely a 'Look what a clever sod I have been'

It was an experiment, there was no intention of inflating my ego from this. I anticipated there would be negative responses and did not expect to make many friends from posting it but it also seems I misjudged the situation in the first instance and for that I apologise.

by **bananafish** » Apr 6th, '05, 20:12

it also seems I misjudged the situation in the first instance and for that I apologise.

And let's allow that be the end of the matter.

talkmagic.co.uk

Brand New Effect

Who is online