talkmagic.co.uk

What gets me, and maybe someone could answer, I'd love to know why. Initially someone has to have brought the item for it to be torrented? Then why give something away for free that you have just paid for? I know I wouldn't.... Maybe that's just because I'm bitter but...

rikgrimsby wrote:found it ordered it

thanks for that

Now you just have to post a picture here with you holding the two DVDs, the box and the little card that comes with the box!
(Proof of purchase!)

phillipnorthfield wrote:What gets me, and maybe someone could answer, I'd love to know why. Initially someone has to have brought the item for it to be torrented? Then why give something away for free that you have just paid for? I know I wouldn't.... Maybe that's just because I'm bitter but...

I think it goes something like:

1.) Order the DVD online.
2.) Steal pics and description text from the website.
3.) Upload the pic and text to eBay for an auction.
4.) Receive the DVD in the mail.
5.) Burn the DVD to another DVD and/or hard drive.
6.) Collect the money from the completed auction and ship the original DVD.
7.) Upload/torrent the DVD to show how cool you are.
8.) Watch the DVD for all of 10 minutes or so.
9.) Then proceed to YouTube where you either:
a.) Bash the DVD for being c*** (not the best) that you don't understand.
b.) Flat out reveal the method(s).
c.) Indirectly reveal the method(s) via a horrific "performance".
10.) Move on to the next flashy thing that catches your eye.

Lawrence wrote:

rikgrimsby wrote:

phillipnorthfield wrote:http://derrenbrown.co.uk/devilspicturebook/store.php

I'm not telling you the answer mind you :p

That wasn't what I meant by 'Digging yourself a hole'.

I'm sure you'll find out.

found it ordered it

thanks for that

hands up those who believe him!

Though this does raise the question, is it OK to download something you already own?

Whether or not we believe him doesn't effect whether or not he did it.
Though of course he shouldn't have downloaded it in the first place.

rikgrimsby wrote:no not at all !! i really wanted it and couldnt find it so i downloaded it, but now ive got it comming in dvd. i didnt use a torrent just a streaming

Thing is, I really want a million pounds, but I'm struggling to find it.
By your logic it's OK for me to go and rob a bank, yes?

Lawrence wrote:

rikgrimsby wrote:no not at all !! i really wanted it and couldnt find it so i downloaded it, but now ive got it comming in dvd. i didnt use a torrent just a streaming

Thing is, I really want a million pounds, but I'm struggling to find it.
By your logic it's OK for me to go and rob a bank, yes?

Yes.... but only if when you don't like the quality of the paper, you pay for some more.

I think the analogy of real life money or whatever else is nulled by the fact that he did not take the DVD from someone he downloaded a COPY. Of course, Derren Brown loses out on money, but if it it's either download it or do without it then Mr Brown's bank balance will remain the same. The only difference is now a magician has access to some great card magic.

Although if you can buy it, which you can, then do so. It's worth it.

Ted wrote:If he doesn't buy it he'll miss out on the hidden content printed on the inside of the DVD box sleeve.

Rilly? I've had the disc for a couple of years now, never even thought of looking on the inside...

Nuts. At work at the mo', will have to wait 'till I get home.

PS. I think my favourite effect is 'Extreme Mental Effort' - just for the sheer cheek of it!

froggymchop wrote:I think the analogy of real life money or whatever else is nulled by the fact that he did not take the DVD from someone he downloaded a COPY. Of course, Derren Brown loses out on money, but if it it's either download it or do without it then Mr Brown's bank balance will remain the same. The only difference is now a magician has access to some great card magic.

Although if you can buy it, which you can, then do so. It's worth it.

You're joining Rik in his hole then, ey?

Mind if I ask what your profession is so I can aim my arguement against your case correctly....

I'm not interested in this enough to have a debate over it. I've posted my 2 cents. But for the record I'd say I only have one foot in the hole.

It's a bit of a non-debate really, isn't it?

Yes, illegal downloading is wrong. (As was 'home taping' all those years ago - remember those labels on the back of LPs 'Home Taping is Killing Music'...?)
Yes, lots of people do it (whilst knowing it's wrong)
And no, nothing we say is likely to stop them

The only thing the OP did wrong was making his actions public on the forum.

I think froggy was just making the debate a bit more honest, and I agree broadly with what he's saying. IP theft is not the same as physical theft, which is not to say that it is the right thing to do.

What does annoy me about the debate, and magic retailers aren't really guilty of this due to the self- and semiself-publishing nature of it all, is that it seems to go on almost exclusively between artists and illegal filesharers. The music labels, who are the ones who kick up a fuss with invented revenue loss figures and drag minors to court, tend to be rather moot on the debate itself. The record industry had a record year last year for single sales; it is not an industry in crisis. What is happening is the increasingly anachronistic phsyical distribution network is rotting. The point at which we are paying the pittance we do pay for the IP and not for the plastic and foil it comes in or the gildy boxes it is delivered in, is the point at which the industry becomes more honest as a whole.

Van_der_Belt wrote:Slight misunderstanding. I'm not against torrents as a technology, I can see great uses for it besides its most common, illegal usage.
What I meant, is that by downloading and seeding illegal downloads you encourage their further download. If I searched for an illegal torrent and found only 'dead' ones with no seeders each time I tried then I'd be discouraged from doing so in the future. The more success I had would maintain my belief that this was a worthwhile thing to do.

Ah, my apologies, now you've explained that makes perfect sense and I agree

froggymchop wrote:I'm not interested in this enough to have a debate over it. I've posted my 2 cents. But for the record I'd say I only have one foot in the hole.

So if I walked into your house and stole your television would that be OK because technically your bank balance stayed the same?

Without getting too deeply into the debate I would just like to point out that I hope anyone who laments the dwindling number of magic shops in the UK, isn't then the kind of person who downloads illegal copies of magic DVD's.

Because naturally by doing so you're making it more difficult for magic shops to stay in business. It's only a small contributing factor to the difficulties faced by magic shop owners, but it exists none the less.