talkmagic.co.uk

Hello all!

There's a lot of mentions on this website about CRB checks when working with children, but it's quite difficult to read through it just looking for practical info. Is it possible to have a thread (this one!) just to talk about the practical issues regarding CRB without the practical issues getting lost among lots of talk of moral issues and so on?

I don't mean that in a stroppy way. Those moral issues are really important. But sometimes a person just needs info. There's a thread on the moral issues here:
http://www.talkmagic.co.uk/ftopic32075.php

My question is...

I've just started doing kids shows, and I've read that I need to be CRB checked but that I myself can't apply for the check. Yet people who have hired me haven't wanted the check. Am I breaking the law if I appear at the party without having been checked? Am I supposed to not work until someone decides that they want to check me?

Thanks for any help!

it is my understanding that if a customer wants a crb check they can get one at there expense.
it is also now my understanding that a crb check is no longer required if you do not have direct unsupervised contact as was the case of the vicker who had to have a crb check every time he took a service.

It's been a few years since my playwork course so I may be wrong here but I'm pretty sure your only legally required to have a C.R.B. check if you're taking care of children in any capacity.

You can't have yourself CRB checked. From the government's website (which is riddled with broken links, by the way):

Directgov wrote:Can you apply for your own criminal record check?
The self-employed or individuals can’t legally apply for a criminal record check on themselves.

T.

Ted wrote:You can't have yourself CRB checked. From the government's website (which is riddled with broken links, by the way):

I read somewhere that there's big changes to the way the government websites are organised taking place tomorrow, funnily enough, tomorrow being 31st March 2011 for anyone reading this in the future. So, POSSIBLY the broken links will be fixed, and it's very likely that the link you posted will only work today!

Yes, I can't check myself, which is part of the problem. If I can't check myself and no one who wants to employ me wants to check me, am I breaking the law if I perform at the party?

The mention above of the vicar case suggests that all of this may no longer be an issue. Can we be sure that that is correct?

Changes are being made to ease the draconian measures introduced a year or two back. In the case of looking after children, the CRB check will only be needed if there are more than a certain number of hours per week involved and this is to cover things like one parent taking other parent's children to school and so on.

IMHO It's always been a good idea to insist that at least two adults, one male one female, be in the room when you do your shows, not only to avoid any suggestions of inappropriate behaviour but also to help keep the kiddiewinks under control.

Mandrake wrote:Changes are being made to ease the draconian measures introduced a year or two back. In the case of looking after children, the CRB check will only be needed if there are more than a certain number of hours per week involved and this is to cover things like one parent taking other parent's children to school and so on.

Thanks for that. Any idea when it comes in? Am I in danger of being arrested, wand in hand, in the meantime?

No idea, sorry - it may still just be a suggestion at this stage. As for any shows in the meantime, just make sure there are other adults in the room and no criticsms can be levelled at you. If the booker asks about CRB checks then he answer is simple, they have to arrange and pay for the check as the current law is such that you can't do this yourself.

If you can't make the checks yourself then it's someone else's responsibility. You can't get into trouble for not forcing them check you! Mandrake's advice on having other adults around all the time is spot on.

You are allowed to work as a children's entertainer if you're not CRB checked.

Many (or most) agencies will insist on it, in which case let them go ahead and have one done on you - as a company, they'll be in a position to do so.

It's when individuals ask for a CRB that you have to start explaining the situation without sounding like you're making excuses.

MY ADVICE: In the absence of a CRB, go to your local police station and request a PNC check (Police National Computer). It costs a tenner, and takes a few weeks to come through, but contains pretty much the same info (or lack of it if you've been a good boy).

If private clients ask to see your CRB, explain that self-employed people aren't allowed to request CRBs on themselves, but offer them the PNC instead as proof that you're not a bad 'un. (Actually, neither the CRB nor PNC will prove that you're not a baddie. they merely prove that you've never been caught!)

Hope that helps,

Pete

I rather think the Devil's tailor is worrying about nothing. Just do the show and forget it. If the booker wants to worry about it let them and respond to them if necessary. The odds are high that depending on what type of booking it is nobody will even bother asking.

To me it would be beyond belief if it were illegal for you to perform. If it were I dare say that half the children's entertainers in the UK would now be in jail.

In school we can have adults without crb checks with the children, so long as they with a member of staff with a CRB. If parents come in they can be alone with their own child, but not an others. So in a situation like a kids party it would be wise to ask for several parents to remain present at all times.

As for applying for a CRB you certainly used to be able to be able put them through yourself as I did for volunteer work. The laws may have changed since then and they are supposed to be getting less restrictive again. Giving the bureau a call will be the easiest way to find out. I've had three in the last six months because my contract has changed, so it counts as a new job meaning new CRB. So while I do want the children safe I would be happier if I only have to do them once a year or whatever.

It is indeed changing, and rightly so, as here in the UK it was getting ridiculous. We heard instances of parents not being allowed to attend their own childs sports day because they dod not have a certificate proving they had no criminal background. Everyone was guilty until proven innocent. Thankfully that is now changing.

This is great of course. Common sense triumphs!

The question is, when it is changing?

I'm not worried about it, just thinking in practical terms.

A quiet word down at your local Police Station might be worth a try and there might be a local beat bobby assigned to your area who'd be able to have a chat about these things, the local libraries will have contact details for him/her.