talkmagic.co.uk

Hello,

I've been learning card tricks for about 6 months now, mainly from books and online, however I do feel like an element is missing from my practise. I think this is mainly to do with pulling it all together, knowing what to focus on, what I am doing wrong etc. I figured that having an experienced card magician look at some of what I've been practising would help this greatly, however I don't know of any in my local area. Do you guys (not only card magicians, but all magicians in general) think having a personal tutor is invaluable or is it possible to make it on your own?

Another related question would be, what resources and methods would you advise to someone in my position - who is currently feeling a bit overwhelmed at the amount of info out there and not really sure what fundamentals I should be acquiring or what route to pursue, but is unable to get some hands on personal advice?

Kind regards

Laurens

You can make it on your own for sure! However, speaking/meeting regularly with other magicians will help you get there a lot quicker, and will help you avoid some of the pitfalls. TM users meet regularly in different parts of the country. There's one coming up in London next week. I'm just about to bump the post so have a look and if you're in the area, you can come and meet a few magicians in a relaxed environment - ie - a pub!!!

K

kevmundo wrote:You can make it on your own for sure! However, speaking/meeting regularly with other magicians will help you get there a lot quicker, and will help you avoid some of the pitfalls. TM users meet regularly in different parts of the country. There's one coming up in London next week. I'm just about to bump the post so have a look and if you're in the area, you can come and meet a few magicians in a relaxed environment - ie - a pub!!!

K

Thanks, I shall keep an eye out for any local magicians that I might get a chance to chat with!

Unfortunately I'm unlikely to be able to get to London at the moment, but hopefully I'd be able to come along to a meet up in future!

Laurens

No worries!

You'll find the denizens of TM to be a friendly, and extremely experienced bunch. If the collective mind of TM doesn't know the answer to a question, then it probably doesn't exist. There are lots of full time professional magicians and obsessive hobbyists who use this forum and their insight and experience is invaluable. I can honestly say that joining this site was the best move in magic I ever made. I've learnt quadruple what I would have learnt on my own - and I've met loads of amazing magicians with a wealth of experience. There'll be lots of future opportunities to meet up with fellow magi if you wish. Just keep an eye on the forum - you'll be more than welcome!!

A lot of people join TM, make a couple of posts, and then leave or are never heard of again. I really think it's their loss. If you're committed to magic, this is the site for you! And no I'm not on commission!

EDIT: I would also add - stay away from youtube. If you use youtube as your guide in magic, you are destined to fail!! The best tutors in magic don't post their advice in a 4 minute clip for free.

K

I watched some card tricks on youtube earlier am now thinking of charity shop hunting too see what books I can find

I will go against the grain and say you will make quicker and surer progress without a mentor. They tend to have big egos. Join a club, mix with guys by all means. But don't bother with a mentor.

Totally agree with TonyB!

TonyB wrote:I will go against the grain and say you will make quicker and surer progress without a mentor. They tend to have big egos. Join a club, mix with guys by all means. But don't bother with a mentor.

Hey! I have mentored quite a few budding young magicians and I think I was quite nice to those poor helpless b******s! Just kidding. They had money.

But seriously. It is true about some people that mentor. They do it to feed their ego. But, you know... it isn't like many magicians like to feed their ego to start.

Your best mentor will be a mirror or video camera for the most part.

Thanks guys, I think this question arose because of reading statements by people who offer a mentor service stating that a mentor is absolutely necessary - but then I guess if you are selling yourself as a mentor, of course you're going to say that!

Laurens, I have been performing professionally for more than fifteen years. Still have not spoken to a mentor. And if the mentor expects to be paid, run a mile.

3 ♣ wrote:Thanks guys, I think this question arose because of reading statements by people who offer a mentor service stating that a mentor is absolutely necessary - but then I guess if you are selling yourself as a mentor, of course you're going to say that!

I agree with TonyB run from the 'mentors' you certainly don't need one. What you need to do is perform. Start small and start simple. But start performing.

Most people who end up with a mentor are not actually looking for one. And the 'mentor' is not really mentoring. Just a friendship forms of like minds and you sit and do some magic for each other, showing moves and all that stuff. Is it necessary? Absolutly not.

I think I agree with Tony. I am completely self taught from books and I never met a magician for the first two years of my studies. I thank the Lord every day for that. If I had met magicians earlier I would have picked up all their bad habits and ended up as mediocre as they are. Just look around and observe all the bad magicians. That is about 90% of them. And they all think they are among the good 10%. They will all agree that there are only 10% of good magicians but they will think that they personally are one of them.

I am not completely against the idea of a mentor but you would have to be VERY careful who that mentor would be. Very selective indeed. If you pick the wrong guy you could be in real trouble and end up even worse off. I have seen this kind of thing happen rather a lot. Magicians in general seem to think that their opinions are important and most of the time they are not. And indeed they can be harmful.

Alas magic clubs are breeding grounds for bad magicians. The blind leading the blind. By all means seek advice but be bloody sure it is good advice. It is a very good policy to assume that any advice you get from other magicians is the wrong advice. Best to either ignore it or look at it very selectively. The only time you should take any notice of it is if it comes from someone you respect.

mark lewis wrote:I think I agree with Tony. I am completely self taught from books and I never met a magician for the first two years of my studies. I thank the Lord every day for that. If I had met magicians earlier I would have picked up all their bad habits and ended up as mediocre as they are. Just look around and observe all the bad magicians. That is about 90% of them. And they all think they are among the good 10%. They will all agree that there are only 10% of good magicians but they will think that they personally are one of them.

I am not completely against the idea of a mentor but you would have to be VERY careful who that mentor would be. Very selective indeed. If you pick the wrong guy you could be in real trouble and end up even worse off. I have seen this kind of thing happen rather a lot. Magicians in general seem to think that their opinions are important and most of the time they are not. And indeed they can be harmful.

Alas magic clubs are breeding grounds for bad magicians. The blind leading the blind. By all means seek advice but be bloody sure it is good advice. It is a very good policy to assume that any advice you get from other magicians is the wrong advice. Best to either ignore it or look at it very selectively. The only time you should take any notice of it is if it comes from someone you respect.

Nail -> Head!

I just 'adopted' a mentor. We've never met (and probably never will), in fact, my mentor doesn't even know I've adopted him!

On my first night at a magic club, someone offered to mentor me for £££ per hour. I was flattered someone was interested in my development so I took a business card.

On the way home I thought back over the encounter. They hadn't seen what level I was at, asked what sort of magic I'd be doing, or taken any interest in me, other than a cursory thought about if they could sell their time to me. I've not got back to them about it.

Avoiding them at the club has turned out to be easy, as they've hardly ever there. They say they can't make it because they're "too busy with gigs" to attend Tuesday night meetings, even in February. Meanwhile their facebook page alternates between complaining they're desperate to get some performing in, asking if anyone following them wants to book them for a restaurant, and re-posting infographics from anti-immigration groups.

I've seen other people perform their though. I've seen what gets good reactions, what is effective for crowd control. And some truly excellent lecturers, Steve Evans stands out particularly.

So, I'd say magic clubs are a mixed bag. Just like books or dvds, there's stuff at them you'll find useful and fits your style, and there's stuff that won't. I think the trick is not to try to adapt your act to use something someone else is telling you that it's vital they sell you.

I think when you pay someone to teach you he is not a mentor. Somehow when money enters the picture it alters the equation. Your tutor is a teacher rather than a mentor. He may well be a superb teacher but somehow I am not sure he is a mentor. I think a mentor is someone who guides you, leads you and advises you but money is not involved to any great extent, if at all.

Dunno. Just thinking out loud.